Holly King=Odin?

wildhunt

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Holly King=Odin?

« on: January 16, 2012, 05:59:34 AM »

In my quest to make sense out of the Holly King and the Oak King, I have come to these conclusions. The Oak King is Cernnunos/ Herne/ Antlered God and the Holly King is a very* Santa Claus-like figure. Santa has his origins in Pagan lore and I think most of us know that. In my research I have found that The God traced back from Santa is the Norse All-Father Odin. In fact, both Gods (Cernnunos and Odin) are Psychopomps and are associated with being the Leaders of the Wild Hunt. So, can I go with the idea of the Oak King, Cernnunos, ruling from Mid-Winter to Mid-Summer and Odin, the Holly King, ruling from Mid-Summer to Mid-Winter? I know it's a bit of a stretch, but there is even more to this and it all seems to fit well enough. What do you think?

RSG


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ThunderWolf

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Re: Holly King=Odin?

« Reply #1 on: January 16, 2012, 03:04:56 PM »

What you say is making sense to me except for one stumbling block. To the best of my knowledge the story of the Oak and Holly Kings is of Celtic origin. That's not to say it necessarily excludes Odin, but my best guess would be that it does.

I'm not entirely knowledgeable about history, but I believe there was interaction between the Nords/Teutons and the Celts. This is why I say I don't believe it necessarily excludes Odin. But also as I stated I lean toward doubting that it involves him.


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daecon

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Re: Holly King=Odin?

« Reply #2 on: January 16, 2012, 03:36:11 PM »

You could make a better case for the parallel if you consider that like Odin, the Holly King is all about death and sacrifice, especially self sacrifice. A good part of the Holly King story is an extended metaphor about harvests and death being necessary to sustain life. There isn't really a perfect match between the two, though, even taking the different cultures into account. Odin kills and resurrects Himself, while Holly dies and goes to the Underworld. He's reborn at Yule as the new Oak King and fathers his killer, the new Holly. With the son kills the father storyline, you could also make a case for a parallel with Kronos and Zeus, though that's not usually thought of as an annual event.


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Daphnis

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Re: Holly King=Odin?

« Reply #3 on: January 26, 2012, 05:36:30 PM »

You could also make the connection between Gilgamesh and Enkidu in "The Epic of Gilgamesh, and also Jesus and John the Baptist. The Oak King (Wild Man of the Forest) and the Holly King, (Refined Gentleman and civilized man) makes lots of parallels.


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wildhunt

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Re: Holly King=Odin?

« Reply #4 on: January 30, 2012, 07:02:56 AM »

That is a very clever association. Good comment.


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Ken Ra

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Re: Holly King=Odin?

« Reply #5 on: January 30, 2012, 11:54:28 AM »

It is actually easier to think of the Holly King as the Holly king and Odin as Odin. They may be the same guy on the other side of the veil or brothers. You see a relationship and that helps you understand both better. Still we are not equipped to see an exact identity or difference between Gods


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